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Skozat · 07-03-2008, 09:16 AM

I playtested 4e and still loathe it. I'm the reason why tanks have to move closer or otherwise do something to their marked target (hey, it was a playtest, we were trying to break it as well as possible). Look me up in the back of the book - Jonathan Culler.

Basically, there's a lot I don't like about the mechanics, in particular the saving throw mechanic, but I could put all that aside. What really gets me is that the game is no longer simulationist. How the hell do you rationalize only being able to trip once every 5 minutes? Do you strain your tripping muscle or something? What about the ranger's ability to give advice and allow another player to reroll a skill that the ranger is trained in with a bonus? Do you run out of advice but gain some more in 5 freaking minutes? Similarly for all the other per encounter or per day physical abilities. The game is no longer trying to simulate how 'actual' characters/people would function in the fantasy realm and is instead more like playing a board game or video game, with no rhyme or reason as to why abilities work the way they do. Within that limitation, it's a fine system, just not one I'd ever want to roleplay in (or indeed is one well suited to roleplaying. It rollplays just fine though.)

However, I am kinda looking forward to the video game adaptation, as a 4e based video game like neverwinter nights would work much better than the 3e/3.5e based video game exactly because the game is so gameist.

Also, WotC are basically being huge dicks about it this time around as far as 3rd party companies. The OGL before let companies make 3rd party products all they wanted, pretty much, and the community flourished with the new ideas and adventures. There is no longer an OGL, companies instead have to pay a bunch of money and crap to be able to produce stuff compliant with 4e. They're also screwing the artists and basically draining all the creativity out of D&D art by telling them exactly what they want each and every picture to look like.

My future D&D needs will be met by the Paizo Pathfinder system, basically 3.75. paizo.com - Pathfinder RPG

07-03-2008, 09:16 AM	#6 (permalink)
Skozat That one guy Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Kentucky Posts: 1,888	I playtested 4e and still loathe it. I'm the reason why tanks have to move closer or otherwise do something to their marked target (hey, it was a playtest, we were trying to break it as well as possible). Look me up in the back of the book - Jonathan Culler. Basically, there's a lot I don't like about the mechanics, in particular the saving throw mechanic, but I could put all that aside. What really gets me is that the game is no longer simulationist. How the hell do you rationalize only being able to trip once every 5 minutes? Do you strain your tripping muscle or something? What about the ranger's ability to give advice and allow another player to reroll a skill that the ranger is trained in with a bonus? Do you run out of advice but gain some more in 5 freaking minutes? Similarly for all the other per encounter or per day physical abilities. The game is no longer trying to simulate how 'actual' characters/people would function in the fantasy realm and is instead more like playing a board game or video game, with no rhyme or reason as to why abilities work the way they do. Within that limitation, it's a fine system, just not one I'd ever want to roleplay in (or indeed is one well suited to roleplaying. It rollplays just fine though.) However, I am kinda looking forward to the video game adaptation, as a 4e based video game like neverwinter nights would work much better than the 3e/3.5e based video game exactly because the game is so gameist. Also, WotC are basically being huge dicks about it this time around as far as 3rd party companies. The OGL before let companies make 3rd party products all they wanted, pretty much, and the community flourished with the new ideas and adventures. There is no longer an OGL, companies instead have to pay a bunch of money and crap to be able to produce stuff compliant with 4e. They're also screwing the artists and basically draining all the creativity out of D&D art by telling them exactly what they want each and every picture to look like. My future D&D needs will be met by the Paizo Pathfinder system, basically 3.75. paizo.com - Pathfinder RPG __________________ Last edited by Skozat; 07-03-2008 at 09:21 AM.